Policy talk:Universal Code of Conduct

How'd this not be redundant with Section 4 of the Terms of Use on refraining from certain activities (and behaviours)? —MarcoAurelio (talk) 20:19, 30 September 2019 (UTC)

@MarcoAurelio:Thank you for your comment. Section 4 of Wikimedia Terms of Use does cover some behavioural guidelines along with content guidelines such as copyright infringement and paid contributions, however it is not a comprehensive list. It is very open to interpretation and not often applied as a guideline on wiki. The Universal Code of Conduct aims to help communities actually apply the section 4 of the Wikimedia Terms of Use by spelling out in more detail, what is covered by them and more focussed conduct guidelines. --NNair (WMF) (talk) 17:26, 1 October 2019 (UTC)

Would it not be more efficient to rewrite Section 4 to be more of a "Projects should have rules that enforce [x], support [y], etc..."? Vermont (talk) 17:44, 1 October 2019 (UTC)

@Vermont: Hi Vermont, interesting point. Any changes to the TOU will have to be approved by the legal team, and we’ll be working with them as this process progresses. A difficulty there is that the section might get lengthy, as language could drift towards legalese. Having a readable and concise TOU is important, so it might be best that the TOU references the UCoC rather than having it live there in full. We’ll let them know about this suggestion, and get their opinions on it.--NNair (WMF) (talk) 06:02, 4 October 2019 (UTC)

Having a readable and concise UCoC is similarly important. I would hope that your vision for a UCoC is one that is more of a basis for how local conduct policies should look, rather than an attempt at removing all local conduct policies and replacing it with a global, English, UCoC.Vermont (talk) 10:12, 4 October 2019 (UTC)

^ Very much this. I hope WMF realizes that if they try to force a code of conduct that is written by themselves on the entire community, it will not go well. The community should really be taking the initiative on this matter. --Rschen7754 17:57, 4 October 2019 (UTC)

This is a good direction I think. Similarly to how the Foundation put out a resolution that all projects should adopt a local policy that upholds basic principles with regard to living persons. GMG^talk 12:30, 6 October 2019 (UTC)

The TOU were written by, and belong to, the community. Even if changes also require Legal's approval, one can't make substantial changes to it without the community's consent. --Yair rand (talk) 17:08, 6 October 2019 (UTC)

The BLP framework is something we have been looking at. It is definitely an applicable approach. Similarly, the UCoC is aiming to come up with a basic, minimum standard for behavioural guidelines, and the idea emphasizes the fact that projects with strong guidelines must be able to abide by and uphold their respective local behavioural policies. In terms of process, the Foundation aims to facilitate the process but the whole project exceedingly depends on the feedback and ideas from the community. We’re working on a more detailed outline/timeline for conversations that we’ll post here. --NNair (WMF) (talk) 03:01, 14 October 2019 (UTC)

Already rejected

If nearly 50 editors randomly come across a proposal to ban the WMF from doing something, and every single one of them supports preventing the WMF from doing that thing, the WMF should probably not do that thing. If you try to push for it anyways, we will have a crisis on our hands, and anyone trying to do any productive work will despair as we yet again need hundreds of volunteers to try to stop the WMF from causing yet another catastrophe. --Yair rand (talk) 17:09, 6 October 2019 (UTC)

Wikimedia LGBT+ meeting minutes October 2019

• Wikimedia LGBT User Group October 2019

Team LGBT+ discussed this proposal in its October meeting. The Wiki LGBT+ community has discussed conduct and misconduct in almost all of its meetings over the past few years and considers itself as a major stakeholder in any broad-reaching conduct proposal. Blue Rasberry (talk) 20:06, 8 October 2019 (UTC)

Hi User:Bluerasberry, thanks for showing up and letting us know about your discussions! We are aware that such discussions are happening in different places and are hoping to gather the input from them in the upcoming consultation about the Universal Code of Conduct. Actually we kickstarted some of those conversations with our session at Wikimania and we are trying start more of them. So we are definitely looking forward to hearing about your ideas and experiences! --CSteigenberger (WMF) (talk) 09:36, 11 October 2019 (UTC)

Are we having a session about this in Boston next month? GMG^talk 12:12, 13 October 2019 (UTC)